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The "Look" Of A (Possible) New Conan Cable Series

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#321 monk

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Posted 02 January 2014 - 12:34 PM

hanuman:

 

hindu-god-hanuman.jpg


"I live, I BURN WITH LIFE, I love, I slay, and am content."
"Here's to brother Painbrush, we drink to his Shade..."
"All Art Is Martial"- RZA

"Our basic purist premise:
ROBERT E. HOWARD, ENTIRELY ALONE, WITHOUT ASSISTANCE FROM ANY OTHER PERSON, CREATED THE CHARACTER CONAN OF CIMMERIA. NO OTHER PERSON OR PERSONS SHOULD BE INTRUDING THEIR WORK INTO THE VOLUMES OF HOWARD'S CONAN STORIES.
In essence, we believe that the work of any creative artist -- writer, painter, illustrator, musician, what-have-you -- is a unique expression of an artistic point of view. It should not be appropriated or altered by others without the artist's consent. No other writer has Robert E. Howard's unique point of view, and no other writer knows what Howard would have done with his character had he lived. Upon his death, his canon, the expression of his artistic vision, became fixed. Tampering with it now is desecration."

#322 monk

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Posted 02 January 2014 - 12:37 PM

Statue+of+Hanuman+(Monkey+God)+-+1937.JPLordHanuman_thumb1.jpg


"I live, I BURN WITH LIFE, I love, I slay, and am content."
"Here's to brother Painbrush, we drink to his Shade..."
"All Art Is Martial"- RZA

"Our basic purist premise:
ROBERT E. HOWARD, ENTIRELY ALONE, WITHOUT ASSISTANCE FROM ANY OTHER PERSON, CREATED THE CHARACTER CONAN OF CIMMERIA. NO OTHER PERSON OR PERSONS SHOULD BE INTRUDING THEIR WORK INTO THE VOLUMES OF HOWARD'S CONAN STORIES.
In essence, we believe that the work of any creative artist -- writer, painter, illustrator, musician, what-have-you -- is a unique expression of an artistic point of view. It should not be appropriated or altered by others without the artist's consent. No other writer has Robert E. Howard's unique point of view, and no other writer knows what Howard would have done with his character had he lived. Upon his death, his canon, the expression of his artistic vision, became fixed. Tampering with it now is desecration."

#323 Albannach

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Posted 02 January 2014 - 07:57 PM

 

I find language and accent in interesting concept to pin down. I do hate it when people all magically speak the same tongue in fantasy films or that accents have no regional segnificance which happens in historic films also.

 

Aquilonian - English (Mid-Atlantic/Theatrical English)

  • Westermarck - English (Cornish)
  • Gundermen - English (Northern English)
     

Cimmerian - Gaelic (Scottish/Irish)

 

Pictish - Welsh

without question introducing languages to a world goes a very long way towards establishing a tangible and believable reality.

 

we know conan had a knack for language and could speak if not fluently but at least conversationally a smattering of them.

 

also mythologies go a very long way towards giving the created world real grit.

 

The Gate of Ishtar:

Ishtar_Gate_at_Berlin_Museum.jpg

 

 

That's what I always got about Conan, he never spoke his native language, he spoke a civilized tongue with a 'barbaric' accent. (This is one of the few things I think made Arnold work in the original film). But when I read the stories I always imagine Conan with a heavy Celtic accent. I may just be biased. Only problem it would face is what language we would make English and how similar are the other Hyborian languages, could we use German, French, Spanish? Perhaps even just the accents.



#324 constantine

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Posted 08 January 2014 - 09:16 AM

In the case of Hanuman, I think that Howard's characteristic description seem to override the actual portrayal by Hindus.

 

However, since we're talking about possible cable series, I would be in favor of replacing Hanuman (who is perceived as a very benevolent entity in Hinduism) by another entity, at least in name. As I have suggested in an older post, Ahriman might be a good substitute.

 

I'm quite negative against political correctness, but IMO this would be a harmless intervention that would not disrespect the either the spirit of the story or any Hinduist beliefs.



#325 monk

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 01:26 AM

 

 

I find language and accent in interesting concept to pin down. I do hate it when people all magically speak the same tongue in fantasy films or that accents have no regional segnificance which happens in historic films also.

 

Aquilonian - English (Mid-Atlantic/Theatrical English)

  • Westermarck - English (Cornish)
  • Gundermen - English (Northern English)
     

Cimmerian - Gaelic (Scottish/Irish)

 

Pictish - Welsh

without question introducing languages to a world goes a very long way towards establishing a tangible and believable reality.

 

we know conan had a knack for language and could speak if not fluently but at least conversationally a smattering of them.

 

also mythologies go a very long way towards giving the created world real grit.

 

The Gate of Ishtar:

Ishtar_Gate_at_Berlin_Museum.jpg

 

 

That's what I always got about Conan, he never spoke his native language, he spoke a civilized tongue with a 'barbaric' accent. (This is one of the few things I think made Arnold work in the original film). But when I read the stories I always imagine Conan with a heavy Celtic accent. I may just be biased. Only problem it would face is what language we would make English and how similar are the other Hyborian languages, could we use German, French, Spanish? Perhaps even just the accents.

 

 

 

as a lover of languages it might be fascinating to hear their old archaic forms used as a basis for the Hyborian age languages and certain accents can certainly go a long way towards establishing that visceral connection but yet not make it sound like people are faking ze french if you catch my drift. In CtB Arnold's accent was just too obvious and came off as corny for a lot of people and easy to make fun of.


"I live, I BURN WITH LIFE, I love, I slay, and am content."
"Here's to brother Painbrush, we drink to his Shade..."
"All Art Is Martial"- RZA

"Our basic purist premise:
ROBERT E. HOWARD, ENTIRELY ALONE, WITHOUT ASSISTANCE FROM ANY OTHER PERSON, CREATED THE CHARACTER CONAN OF CIMMERIA. NO OTHER PERSON OR PERSONS SHOULD BE INTRUDING THEIR WORK INTO THE VOLUMES OF HOWARD'S CONAN STORIES.
In essence, we believe that the work of any creative artist -- writer, painter, illustrator, musician, what-have-you -- is a unique expression of an artistic point of view. It should not be appropriated or altered by others without the artist's consent. No other writer has Robert E. Howard's unique point of view, and no other writer knows what Howard would have done with his character had he lived. Upon his death, his canon, the expression of his artistic vision, became fixed. Tampering with it now is desecration."

#326 monk

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 01:34 AM

In the case of Hanuman, I think that Howard's characteristic description seem to override the actual portrayal by Hindus.

 

However, since we're talking about possible cable series, I would be in favor of replacing Hanuman (who is perceived as a very benevolent entity in Hinduism) by another entity, at least in name. As I have suggested in an older post, Ahriman might be a good substitute.

 

I'm quite negative against political correctness, but IMO this would be a harmless intervention that would not disrespect the either the spirit of the story or any Hinduist beliefs.

 

They entered a court paved with marble which gleamed whitely in the starlight. A short flight of broad marble steps led up to the pillared portico. The great bronze doors stood wide open as they had stood for centuries. But no worshippers burnt incense within. In the day men and women might come timidly into the shrine and place offerings to the ape-god on the black altar. At night the people shunned the temple of Hanuman as hares shun the lair of the serpent.

 

Burning censers bathed the interior in a soft, weird glow that created an illusion of unreality. Near the rear wall, behind the black stone altar, sat the god with his gaze fixed for ever on the open door, through which for centuries his victims had come, dragged by chains of roses. A faint groove ran from the sill to the altar, and when Conan's foot felt it, he stepped away as quickly as if he had trodden upon a snake. That groove had been worn by the faltering feet of the multitude of those who had died screaming on that grim altar.

 

Bestial in the uncertain light, Hanuman leered with his carven mask. He sat, not as an ape would crouch, but cross-legged as a man would sit, but his aspect was no less simian for that reason. He was carved from black marble, but his eyes were rubies, which glowed red and lustful as the coals of hell's deepest pits. His great hands lay upon his lap, palms upward, taloned fingers spread and grasping. In the gross emphasis of his attributes, in the leer of his satyr-countenance, was reflected the abominable cynicism of the degererate cult which deified him.


"I live, I BURN WITH LIFE, I love, I slay, and am content."
"Here's to brother Painbrush, we drink to his Shade..."
"All Art Is Martial"- RZA

"Our basic purist premise:
ROBERT E. HOWARD, ENTIRELY ALONE, WITHOUT ASSISTANCE FROM ANY OTHER PERSON, CREATED THE CHARACTER CONAN OF CIMMERIA. NO OTHER PERSON OR PERSONS SHOULD BE INTRUDING THEIR WORK INTO THE VOLUMES OF HOWARD'S CONAN STORIES.
In essence, we believe that the work of any creative artist -- writer, painter, illustrator, musician, what-have-you -- is a unique expression of an artistic point of view. It should not be appropriated or altered by others without the artist's consent. No other writer has Robert E. Howard's unique point of view, and no other writer knows what Howard would have done with his character had he lived. Upon his death, his canon, the expression of his artistic vision, became fixed. Tampering with it now is desecration."

#327 constantine

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Posted 11 January 2014 - 11:29 AM

That part of the story I had in mind. To be sure, I wasn't referring to Hanuman's apish aspect, but the ''satyr countenance'' and the ''gross emphasis of his attributes'' (probably an exaggerated fertility imagery or something similar). In short, his real world representations, earlier photos included, do not seem to project an exceedingly evil, bestial nature and whatnot.

 

Anyway, my basic suggestion was that in a Conan cable series it would be better if Hanuman was replaced with another deity. This might require certain further changes, for example, in the image of the evil god that would substitute Hanuman.



#328 Ironhand

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Posted 12 January 2014 - 08:32 AM

Did REH ever mention a gorilla-god, or is that strictly from the comics?


"Did you deem yourself strong, because you were able to twist the heads off civilized folk, poor weaklings with muscles like rotten string? Hell! Break the neck of a wild Cimmerian bull before you call yourself strong. I did that, before I was a full-grown man...!" - Conan, in "Shadows in Zamboula", by Robert E. Howard
"... you speak of Venarium familiarly. Perhaps you were there?"
"I was," grunted [Conan]. "I was one of the horde that swarmed over the hills. I hadn't yet seen fifteen snows, but already my name was repeated about the council fires." - "Beyond the Black River", by Robert E. Howard

Read my Conan screenplays at The Scrolls of Ironhand (in particular my transcription of THE FROST GIANT'S DAUGHTER in Act II of "The Snow Devil") at
http://www.scrollsof...d.us/index.html or at
http://www.delicious...ic=ConanProject

#329 constantine

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Posted 12 January 2014 - 01:29 PM

Did REH ever mention a gorilla-god, or is that strictly from the comics?

 

Hanuman is described by REH as an ape-god of sorts and that seems to be the case of Gullah, a god apparently worshiped by the Picts (in BtBR, the bull-ape is said to be sacred to this god according to Pictish beliefs).



#330 Ironhand

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 05:27 AM

 

Did REH ever mention a gorilla-god, or is that strictly from the comics?

 

Hanuman is described by REH as an ape-god of sorts and that seems to be the case of Gullah, a god apparently worshiped by the Picts (in BtBR, the bull-ape is said to be sacred to this god according to Pictish beliefs).

 

So substitute Gullah for Hanuman if "Hanuman" would be politically offensive.  At least it's a Howardian name.,,


"Did you deem yourself strong, because you were able to twist the heads off civilized folk, poor weaklings with muscles like rotten string? Hell! Break the neck of a wild Cimmerian bull before you call yourself strong. I did that, before I was a full-grown man...!" - Conan, in "Shadows in Zamboula", by Robert E. Howard
"... you speak of Venarium familiarly. Perhaps you were there?"
"I was," grunted [Conan]. "I was one of the horde that swarmed over the hills. I hadn't yet seen fifteen snows, but already my name was repeated about the council fires." - "Beyond the Black River", by Robert E. Howard

Read my Conan screenplays at The Scrolls of Ironhand (in particular my transcription of THE FROST GIANT'S DAUGHTER in Act II of "The Snow Devil") at
http://www.scrollsof...d.us/index.html or at
http://www.delicious...ic=ConanProject

#331 Albannach

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Posted 23 January 2014 - 07:32 AM

Perhaps a bridge between TV series and feature film could be found in TV movies. Kind of in the mold of Columbo in the sense that there would be no 'Next time on Conan..' This way we can jump through the stories and feel no need to connect them.



#332 deuce

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 08:41 AM

Barry Windsor-Smith always depicted an authentic "feel" (ie, true to what REH liked/described) for his Conan work. Compare:

 

bwsmtihartmain.jpg

 

The cinquedea:

 

sword_cinquedea_1__06751_zoom.jpg


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