342 replies to this topic

[deuce]

Greetings!
Now don't jump into it all at once,.....


Tu (shoot)

Hold on, Tu! I haven't gotten up the annotations for the second chapter (but I will ). Happy St. Paddy's Day.

[Taranaich]

A couple more things I thought I'd add:

[quote name='deuce' post='83965' date='Mar 10 2008, 11:41 PM']Orastes claimed that he might've been burned as a magician. I'm sure that some will point to this as an example of the Mitran priesthood's "oppressiveness" or "degeneracy". The thing is, in a milieu where "black magic" is an actual reality, this is a very sensible attitude. Would Conan disapprove of a "black magician" being burned? I seriously doubt it. While they persecute the Asurans, on the whole, the Mitran priests seem fairly tolerant. There appears to be no hint of persecution towards the "Ibis cult".[/quote]

Interesting. Could execution by burning have had some sort of practical reasoning, i.e. "cleansing and purifying" the body from evil corruption, or would it have been ironic justice, like the Byzantines burning "fire-worshipping" Zoroastrians? Either way, it isn't fanatical when the beasties and their servants are, ahem, somewhat more overt and aggressive than in modern and medieval times.

[quote]WHERE is this "giant-walled temple of Set"? In Chapter XVI, there is also a mention of a "holy city" in the hinterlands. Orastes also speaks of a "subterranean temple".[/quote]

Hmm, from dictionary.com:

1. Often, hinterlands. the remote or less developed parts of a country; back country: The hinterlands are usually much more picturesque than the urban areas.
2. the land lying behind a coastal region.
3. an area or sphere of influence in the unoccupied interior claimed by the state possessing the coast.
4. an inland area supplying goods, esp. trade goods, to a port.

So I'd presume somewhere in the west, near the coast. Maybe the centre, if the borders are more developed than the desert interior.

[quote]Apparently, lore concerning the Heart isn't contained in the books of Skelos. Orastes had to find his information elsewhere.[/quote]

Presumably that would mean the books are older than the Heart, as surely they'd mention such a mighty artefact.

[quote]Valerius: He was described as a "tall, yellow-haired man". Valerius was claimed to be, by Orastes, "the rightful heir of the throne of Aquilonia". He had been driven into exile by his royal kinsman, Namedides. He had been absent from Aquilonia "for years", but he was "of the blood of the old dynasty". (p.82, 86, 88)
I always thought that Karl Edward Wagner could've written some good tales concerning Valerius.[/quote]

I wonder what Valerius was doing during the War of the Barons... One would think that would have been an ideal time for him to strike for the throne. Of course, it's likely he was too far away to do so: indeed, maybe he was in Khitai rescuing those four bald chaps.

[quote]This "red heart of the night" doesn't sound like any sort of "Grail". It also doesn't sound like it was forged by "Monster-kings".[/quote]

Grail? Monster-Kings? Is this a comics/pastiche reference, I'm afraid I'm not up to speed on them.

[quote]Here we see the concept of "Elder" Corinthia, Ophir and Koth. They existed 3000+yrs ago as well. The idea, held by some, that Hyborians were ALL skin-clad, tawny-haired barbarians at the time of the fall of Acheron appears to be wrong.[/quote]

They could still be skin-clad and tawny eyed, I suppose, before admixture with Zhemri and the like.

[quote]Also, REH is strongly intimating that Aquilonian/Nemedian/Argossean culture rose on the "ruins" of Acheron. Thus, the persistent "dragon" imagery seen in both Aquilonia and Nemedia.[/quote]

It's a shame we don't see any dragon imagery with Argos (unless the "dragon-prowed" Tigress counts, maybe it was formerly an Argossean galley?)

[quote]Xaltotun's comments concerning Orastes' map are intriguing.[/quote]

"Outlines of the land" seem to indicate territorial regions, but what exactly changed? Acheron was split into Aquilonia, Nemedia and Argos, Stygia lost a lot of territory... and that seems to be it. Maybe he means the geography?

Incidentally, where was Brythunia and the Border Kingdom in all this? Aquilonia, Nemedia, Argos, Koth, Ophir and Corinthia are all accounted for in the history lesson on Acheron. Hyperborea and Zingara's origins are given in the Hyborian Age essay. So what about those two errant kingdoms? Were they "first generation" Hyborian kingdoms like Corinthia, Ophir and Koth, or were they "second generation" like Aquilonia, Nemedia and Argos?

It's strange that Brythunia at least isn't mentioned, since it would presumably lie between Acheron and the older, stronger Zamora. Maybe it was part of Corinthia before being split/overrun by the second wave of Hyborians. Could the Border Kingdom have been established as a "buffer zone" by the Nemedians... or by Acheron? "Not even the Kings of Acheron" could conquer the Cimmerians, so perhaps they set up the Border Kingdom to keep them out.

[Kane]

Interesting. Could execution by burning have had some sort of practical reasoning, i.e. "cleansing and purifying" the body from evil corruption, or would it have been ironic justice, like the Byzantines burning "fire-worshipping" Zoroastrians? Either way, it isn't fanatical when the beasties and their servants are, ahem, somewhat more overt and aggressive than in modern and medieval times.

Given that at the end of the story The Scarlet Citadel we see a decapitated wizard's body start chasing after it's head, I would think that burning had a very pratical reason.
In addition, a few stories had a re-animated corpse causing problems for our favorite barbarian and other.
So even if the majority of the people had never seen a risen corpse, it is not unlikely that the stories of such did pass through the various nations.
Execution by burning would have helped make sure that any condemed wizard could not return at a later time and seek vengence on those who ordered his death. It's possible that after the body was consumed by the fire steps were taken to collect the remaining bones and have them smashed to powder. Followed by scattering them to the winds or dumping them in either a river or the ocean.

[matsellah]

It's been soooo long since I've had a chance to sit down and reread. All I can say right now is that HoTD and TPoTBC are my top 2 REH stories.

The first time I read Orastes' description of Conan in this novel raised those proverbial goosebumps and has forever cemented itself in my mind's eye of who is Conan, and it's why it's always been part of my signature.

[deuce]

I thought I'd jump-start this fine thread. Like Tu said, where you guys at?

Chapter II: A Black Wind Blows

"The year of the Dragon": "had birth in war and pestilence and unrest." (p.91) I wonder if the "year of the Dragon" was generally thought of as "unlucky" amongst the Hyborian kingdoms?
"the black plague": It struck down "the serf in his kennel" and "the knight at his banquet board". The onset of this plague sounds unnaturally swift: "The victim's body turned purple and then black, and within a few minutes he sank down dying, and the stench of his own putrefaction was in his nostrils even before death wrenched his soul from his rotting body." Meanwhile, a "hot roaring wind blew incessantly from the south, and the crops withered in the fields, the cattle sank and died in their tracks." Carts, hung with "grim and ominous bells" "lumbered through the streets gathering up the rotting dead." (p.91-92)
"Putrefaction" was a term, AFAIK, first concocted by medieval alchemists
the Nemedian king: "In one night", he and "his three sons" were felled by the plague. Their "dirge" was "thundered" by "drums". (p.92) As we shall see, the deaths of Aquilonian kings were heralded by bells.
Tarascus: He was "crowned in the great coronation hall". "Men said" that he was a "monarch on whom the gods smiled." (p.92) As in several other instances, here we see that the Mitra-worshipping nations didn't worship just Mitra. The new king "declared the truce made by the late king with their western neighbors (Aquilonia) void". (p.92) Was the "late king" the "King Numa" that Prospero journeyed to see in "TPotS"? What about King Nimed, Tarascus' brother? There are only a few years betwixt "Phoenix" and "Dragon". Perhaps Numa was a very old, ailing king who was succeeded by his son(?), Nimed. Maybe the uncertainty during Numa's final days (or Nimed's first ones) is what kept Nemedia out of the party during the Scarlet Citadel period?
Amalric: He possessed "vast personal wealth", which he funneled into the Nemedian treasury. "If any shrewd individuals suspected that Amalric was the real ruler of Nemedia, behind the scenes, they were careful not to voice such heresy." (p.92) To me, it looks like REH was echoing Ovid's "Treason doth never prosper" quote (used later by Shakespeare).

the Nemedian host: The king moved westward with "his allies" at the head of "fifty thousand men". The army consisted of "knights in shining armor with their pennons streaming above their helmets, pikemen in steel caps and brigandines, crossbowmen in leather jerkins." Crossing the Aquilonian border, the Nemedians "took a frontier castle". (p.92) I can't find anything in the above description that sounds vaguely "Greco-Roman".
Tarascus: He had "struck without warning. His invasion had come on the heels of his proclamation, without formal declaration of war." (p.92) Sounds like Tarascus and his crew had laid some serious groundwork before he was crowned. Gathering a non-mechanized army is no joke.

the Aquilonian host: It consisted of "forty-five thousand knights, archers and men-at-arms, the flower of Aquilonian strength and chivalry." (p.92) Sounds a LOT like the army of Edward the Black Prince (of whom REH was a BIG fan).

"the valley of the Valkia": It lay "ten miles west of the boundary line". It was "a wide, shallow valley, with rugged cliffs, and a shallow stream winding through masses of reeds and willows down the middle of the vale." The valley was situated on a north-south axis, the Aquilonians encamping near the western cliffs and the invaders on the eastern side. (p.92-93)
the Nemedian banner: It was emblazoned with a scarlet dragon on a golden field. (p.93)
the Aquilonian banner: It displayed a golden lion on a black field. (p.93)
King Conan's pavillion: His couch was "a pile of silks and furs thrown upon a dais ". The tent was lit by a "great golden lamp which shed a soft glow over the velvet hangings and carpets". "Seven knights" guarded it. (p.93)
Conan: He had "seen death strike a king in the midst of thousands". (p.93) Apparently, this refers to his time with the army of Prince Almuric, though, obviously, Almuric wasn't a "king".

Conan's dream: "I saw again the battlefield whereon I was born. I saw myself in a pantherskin loin-clout, throwing my spear at the mountain beasts. I was a mercenary swordsman again, a hetman of the kozaki who dwell along the Zaparoska River, a corsair looting the coasts of Kush, a pirate of the Barachan Isles, a chief of the Himelian hillmen." (p.94)
Here's the Cimmerian in his "fur-undies" back in Cimmeria. One of the few times we see Conan with a spear (a much-neglected weapon). Also, one of the few mentions of the "mountains" of Cimmeria, as opposed to "hills".
Conan: He had "dreamed many evil dreams". (p.94) One doesn't usually associate Conan with "nightmares". This kind of reminds me of the excised "melancholy" scene in The Phoenix on the Sword. I can't remember reading whether Howard suffered from "evil dreams" or not.

King Nimed: The former king of Nemedia, Tarascus' older brother. (p.94)
the black plague: According to Conan, it was "no common pestilence." It "lurked in Stygian tombs" and was called forth "only by wizards." (p.94)

Conan: He was "a swordsman in Prince Almuric's army that invaded Stygia, and of his thirty thousand, fifteen thousand perished by Stygian arrows, and the rest by the black plague". Conan was the only man that survived. (p.94) With the thousand or so Conan pastiche novels cranked out over the years, why didn't anyone go to the trouble to chronicle the "Almuric campaign"?
the Aquilonian army: Its "hosts" were "marshalled" by "captains". (p.94)
Conan's sleeping habits: He wore a "velvet night-garment". He insisted "on sleeping alone in his chamber or tent." Apparently, the "civilized" Aquilonians found this "inexplicable". If this was a legacy of his "barbaric" upbringing, then it is quite unusual. The vast majority of "barbarian/savage" cultures that we know of tend toward communal sleeping, as do the common people in many cultures today. As a general rule, up until the modern day, only aristocrats and other "high-and-mighties" have had the "luxury" to indulge in "single sleeping".
"royal squires": Apparently, Conan had five to attend him. (p.96)
Conan: As in The Scarlet Citadel, Conan went to war with a "great two-handed sword". (p.95)

Valannus: He was "a captain of the Pellian spearmen." He was "a tall man, broad and powerful, built much like the king." He was clad in a "mail shirt, burganet and leg-pieces" when he reached the royal pavillion. (p.97) Presumably, this is the normal outfit of Pellian spearmen. Here, as REH depicted in other Conan yarns, we see someone else just as big as Conan. I wonder if Valannus was among the Pellians Arpello brought to Tamar? If so, he repaid his one-time treason in full. I also have to wonder what Valannus' comrades thought when he didn't come back from his visit to the king.

Conan's panoply: It consisted of "black plate-mail, with the visored salade, and the dark plumes nodding over the wivern crest." Over that went "the silken surcoat with the royal lion worked in gold upon the breast" and then a broad gold-buckled belt which supported a jewel-hilted broadsword in a cloth-of-gold scabbard." (p.97) So, was Conan packin' a "two-handed sword" AND a "broadsword"?

Conan: He tells Valannus, "Bring me Tarascus' head and I'll make you a baron!" Under the stress of his rage, the Cimmerian's "veneer of civilization had fallen from him" and he was "as barbaric as any tribesman in the Cimmerian hills." (p.98) Once again, "Cimmerian hills". Edgar Rice Burroughs used the "veneer of civilization" line many times in his Tarzan novels. Does Conan's demand for his rival's head imply that the Cimmerians indulged in "Celt-style" head-hunting? I doubt it, but it's a thought.
You really feel Conan's helplessness in this chapter. Is it perhaps reflective of Howard's feelings of being trapped in his parents' "pavilion" while the world went on outside? Or is it connected to his sense of being "born out of his time" and only being able to read about the events and times he wanted to have lived in?


End of Chapter II

[Kortoso]

We've probably discussed this before, but how would you pronounce Xaltotun?

[deuce]

We've probably discussed this before, but how would you pronounce Xaltotun?

Hey Kortoso! How do I pronounce it? Or how do I think REH pronounced it?

Since "Dragon" was the first Conan yarn I read, my pronunciation is kinda "fossilized". If I'm NOT thinking about it, I say, "ZAL-toht'n". If I do think about it, I pronounce it "ksal-toh-toon" (even stress), trying to get max "exoticness" out of the name.

With REH, it's hard to say. He seems to have been pretty familiar with Spanish and we know that he pronounced "Nineveh" as "nin-eh-vay" (ie, the "correct" way), so he might have gone with the "straight" pronunciation or maybe with the "exotic". Who knows?

Of course, there's the (possibly) related name of "Xuthltan". Xuthltan/Stregoicavar is situated in western Hungary, which would put it on or just south of the Nemedian border. "Xuthltan" was also the name of the western wizard in The Fire of Asshurbanipal.

[Kortoso]

Initial "X" is a puzzle for modern readers, probably the reason REH liked to use it. A quick injection into a strange world.
I like the voiceless velar fricative myself; it's the "kh" sound that sends spittle flying, a sound that reminds us of exotic ancient languages.
But it's more of a question; I think everyone will come up with something different.

[deuce]

But it's more of a question; I think everyone will come up with something different.

I have no doubts on that.

[Taranaich]

Bwahaha, excellent!

[quote]"the black plague": It struck down "the serf in his kennel" and "the knight at his banquet board". The onset of this plague sounds unnaturally swift: "The victim's body turned purple and then black, and within a few minutes he sank down dying, and the stench of his own putrefaction was in his nostrils even before death wrenched his soul from his rotting body." Meanwhile, a "hot roaring wind blew incessantly from the south, and the crops withered in the fields, the cattle sank and died in their tracks." Carts, hung with "grim and ominous bells" "lumbered through the streets gathering up the rotting dead." (p.91-92)
"Putrefaction" was a term, AFAIK, first concocted by medieval alchemists[/quote]

I've always wondered exactly what kind of "plague" would cause such a horrifically rapid transformation, going through all the major stages of decomposition within minutes. I know the answer is just technically "because it's magic", but it'd be nice to kind of break it down a little.

[quote]Tarascus: He was "crowned in the great coronation hall". "Men said" that he was a "monarch on whom the gods smiled." (p.92) As in several other instances, here we see that the Mitra-worshipping nations didn't worship just Mitra. The new king "declared the truce made by the late king with their western neighbors (Aquilonia) void". (p.92) Was the "late king" the "King Numa" that Prospero journeyed to see in "TPotS"? What about King Nimed, Tarascus' brother? There are only a few years betwixt "Phoenix" and "Dragon". Perhaps Numa was a very old, ailing king who was succeeded by his son(?), Nimed. Maybe the uncertainty during Numa's final days (or Nimed's first ones) is what kept Nemedia out of the party during the Scarlet Citadel period?[/quote]

I had been wondering about the changes in kingship between Phoenix and Dragon: I personally thought Numa was not a fan of Numedides, and welcomed the change in management Conan brought, thus the truce between the two nations. The death of Numa and Nimed's succession could well have been the reason Nemedia waited out Citadel. I also wonder what relation Nimed (and Tarascus) were to Numa: obviously he could be the other two's father, but it's also possible the three were brothers. Perhaps Numa had a sudden death off gallivanting around: having "dancing-girls" could mean he was a lively, adventurous sort (or a dirty old man).

Also, where does Nimed's wife fit into all this? Having his three sons slain must mean they were legitimate heirs, but Howard explicitly does not mention her demise. I guess Tarascus did the "gentlemanly" thing and married his wife's widow. This, of course, assuming she had not died some years previously.

[quote]the Nemedian host: The king moved westward with "his allies" at the head of "fifty thousand men".[/quote]

I presume his allies are Xaltotun, Amalric and Valerius, though where were the latter two at Valkia?

[quote]Tarascus: He had "struck without warning. His invasion had come on the heels of his proclamation, without formal declaration of war." (p.92) Sounds like Tarascus and his crew had laid some serious groundwork before he was crowned. Gathering a non-mechanized army is no joke.[/quote]

I suspect this was Amalric's doing: mobilizing for war with such numbers would undoubtedly cause raised eyebrows in certain quarters if not handled carefully enough.

[quote]Conan: He had "seen death strike a king in the midst of thousands". (p.93) Apparently, this refers to his time with the army of Prince Almuric, though, obviously, Almuric wasn't a "king".[/quote]

Hmm, not sure about that, considering the thousands surrounding the king also died it doesn't seem a suitable reference. Perhaps it's a reference to Bhunda Chand, who was slain by the Black Seers despite (presumably) the best efforts of the priests of Asura, and being surrounded by the pride of Vendhya?

[quote]the black plague: According to Conan, it was "no common pestilence." It "lurked in Stygian tombs" and was called forth "only by wizards." (p.94)

Conan: He was "a swordsman in Prince Almuric's army that invaded Stygia, and of his thirty thousand, fifteen thousand perished by Stygian arrows, and the rest by the black plague". Conan was the only man that survived. (p.94)[/quote]

So is it fair to say that Xaltotun's black plague and the one that slew Almuric's army all those years ago were the same thing, or at least similar? One wonders how the Stygians lost their empire with firepower like that!

[quote]With the thousand or so Conan pastiche novels cranked out over the years, why didn't anyone go to the trouble to chronicle the "Almuric campaign"?[/quote]

One of many really cool things that really needed should have been attempted. Then again, it could've ended up like Conan the Liberator...

Edited by Kortoso, 05 April 2008 - 04:58 PM.
fixed quote

[Taranaich]

Continued...

Conan's sleeping habits: He wore a "velvet night-garment". He insisted "on sleeping alone in his chamber or tent." Apparently, the "civilized" Aquilonians found this "inexplicable". If this was a legacy of his "barbaric" upbringing, then it is quite unusual. The vast majority of "barbarian/savage" cultures that we know of tend toward communal sleeping, as do the common people in many cultures today. As a general rule, up until the modern day, only aristocrats and other "high-and-mighties" have had the "luxury" to indulge in "single sleeping".

Perhaps it's just a quirk of Conan's personality: he's so used to sleeping alone in the hills/forests/street/jungles that he prefers it.

Valannus: He was "a captain of the Pellian spearmen." He was "a tall man, broad and powerful, built much like the king." He was clad in a "mail shirt, burganet and leg-pieces" when he reached the royal pavillion. (p.97) Presumably, this is the normal outfit of Pellian spearmen. Here, as REH depicted in other Conan yarns, we see someone else just as big as Conan. I wonder if Valannus was among the Pellians Arpello brought to Tamar? If so, he repaid his one-time treason in full. I also have to wonder what Valannus' comrades thought when he didn't come back from his visit to the king.

Could well have been: those Pellians mentioned had arbalests, but I'm sure there would have been spearmen support too. Wonder if those spearmen suspected something...

Conan's panoply: It consisted of "black plate-mail, with the visored salade, and the dark plumes nodding over the wivern crest." Over that went "the silken surcoat with the royal lion worked in gold upon the breast" and then a broad gold-buckled belt which supported a jewel-hilted broadsword in a cloth-of-gold scabbard." (p.97) So, was Conan packin' a "two-handed sword" AND a "broadsword"?

I don't see why he wouldn't carry a second weapon, seeing as it would be unfortunate to break your sword in a melee without a backup. Of course, Conan also adds an axe to his royal arsenal in Chapter 22, though he'd switch back to broadsword before the battle's end. Conan must go through a lot of weapons when he gets going!

Conan: He tells Valannus, "Bring me Tarascus' head and I'll make you a baron!" Under the stress of his rage, the Cimmerian's "veneer of civilization had fallen from him" and he was "as barbaric as any tribesman in the Cimmerian hills." (p.98) Once again, "Cimmerian hills". Edgar Rice Burroughs used the "veneer of civilization" line many times in his Tarzan novels. Does Conan's demand for his rival's head imply that the Cimmerians indulged in "Celt-style" head-hunting? I doubt it, but it's a thought.

What are your doubts about such a thing? I can see why they wouldn't go for head-hunting in a religious sense, but it might be a more practical "look who I shanked!" tradition. Didn't Cuchullain mount the heads of Nechtan Scene's three sons on his chariot?

You really feel Conan's helplessness in this chapter. Is it perhaps reflective of Howard's feelings of being trapped in his parents' "pavilion" while the world went on outside? Or is it connected to his sense of being "born out of his time" and only being able to read about the events and times he wanted to have lived in?

It could be both. I'm also reminded of the James Allison tales for some reason, that idea of a barbaric soul trapped in a helpless body. It seems to be all tied in to Howard's tragic heroism, where despite the enormity of the universe and the hero's insignificance to change or defeat it, the hero still rages against it: Conan's paralyzed, but he's damned if he's going to lie there resigned to it!

And for the record, I also say "Zahl-toh-toon" with even stress on all syllables.

[deuce]

I've always wondered what exactly was happening with the door: what were the "shapes of darkness" that followed Xaltotun from the Doors of Hell? Was it magical atmospheric pressure? Some "things" of the Outer Dark forcing through? Was the very state of reality being altered by the spell? Howard doesn't tell us, nor should he, as the ambiguity makes it all the more unsettling.

Hey Taranaich! I agree. I hafta admit that I've always instinctively imagined a "hell-hound" or "demon" at the door.

Pretty convincing "aspect of life" if his resurrection caused him to break open his mummy bandages, and the conspirators felt "firm muscular flesh, vibrant with blood and life". I guess it means Zelata is just really, really perceptive, since Xaltotun does seem for all intents and purposes "alive", or gave an extremely effective impression of it.

Well, REH several times wrote of seeing "the skull beneath the skin". I'd think that Xaltotun was "clothed" in "life" while not really being "alive". A few could see that; most could not.

Where did the "stars and crescents" motif for wizards come from? Is it based on mythological or folkloric designs, or is it the work of later authors (Dunsany, Smith, Peake?) It might seem rather goofy for a series sorcerer to wear robes more associated with party magicians, but remember that many similar fairy tale tropes had much darker origins than Disney would have you believe.

From what I understand, medieval practicioners of alchemy (which involved astrology) often donned such robes. There's a possibility that even earlier astrologers did so. I recommend Aveni's Conversing with the Planets.

Pretty impressive, since the Acheronians seem to have literally earth-shattering magics and plagues, one wonders how even the Cimmerians resisted them. It's possible the Acheronians couldn't be bothered conquering the land itself (then again, why would the Aquilonians set up Venarium if it was worthless?), or that it had problems elsewhere that required their attention. I wonder if Crom got in the way of Set's magic: not on behalf of the Cimmerians, but more a "Ho You, Get Off Mah Land!" to Set and his minions. That's if Crom even exists, of course.

I had the same thought. Really, I have to admit, Xaltotun/Acheron seems a li'l bit over-powered. With all the tools at their disposal, it's hard to see how ancient Stygia and Acheron didn't rule the entire world. However, that only becomes obvious on close study. It's never hindered my enjoyment of the yarn.

[deuce]

the Nemedian host: The king moved westward with "his allies" at the head of "fifty thousand men".

I presume his allies are Xaltotun, Amalric and Valerius, though where were the latter two at Valkia?

Hey Taranaich! I was wondering as well. Is it possible that "his allies" refers to Borderers or Brythunians?

Hmm, not sure about that, considering the thousands surrounding the king also died it doesn't seem a suitable reference. Perhaps it's a reference to Bhunda Chand, who was slain by the Black Seers despite (presumably) the best efforts of the priests of Asura, and being surrounded by the pride of Vendhya?

I was wondering that as well. Conan didn't "see" Bhunda Chand die. Almuric wasn't a "king". Perhaps we're looking at a totally unknown incident here.

So is it fair to say that Xaltotun's black plague and the one that slew Almuric's army all those years ago were the same thing, or at least similar? One wonders how the Stygians lost their empire with firepower like that!

Conan strongly implies that the two are one and the same. As I noted in a previous post, it's hard to see how ancient Acheron and Stygia didn't rule the entire world.

[godzilladude]

So, I'm in the midst of a big project involving original typescripts, including drafts, all sorts of stuff. Today at lunch I come across an early draft of Hour of the Dragon. Near the beginning, as the dead wizard starts to come alive, one of the players says:

?Ishtar!? he gasped. ?It is Xaltotun!?and he lives! Valerius! Tarascus! Amalric! Do you see?"

Or, at least that is what is in the Weird Tales version. But in the version I was looking at it says:

?Ishtar!? he gasped. ?Thoth-Amon spoke truth. It is Xaltotun!?and he lives! Valerius! Tarascus! Amalric! Do you see?"


What?!? Thoth-Amon spoke the truth about what? IDing the corpse? The power of the Heart? The spell would work?

And who'd he speak it to? One of the conspirators? Some spy?

What REH was planning to do with the early foreshadowing of Thoth-Amon and his contact, somehow, with the conspirators, I dunno. Obviously REH changed his mind and got rid of it later, leaving Thoth-Amon strictly as unseen and inactive Boss Wizard in Stygia. Damn curious.

[godzilladude]

Oh man! And much later in the story, at the point where the word gets out that Conan is alive, and the conspirators are planning for the big battle (near the start of Chapter 22), there is a half page gap, just before it mentions Amalric spreading out the map. And in that space, REH has pencilled in (what else) a map! Oh, its just a very simple one, of the battlefield and the river, and even indicates where the rain is going to fall. Clearly being used as a visual note to work from.

Still, gotta punch this out to the masses sometime. It ain't anything showy, but still nice to work with. Someday.