140 replies to this topic

[Reaver]

In all fairness, Spawn and The Maxx, as entertaining as they were, were pretty juvenile anyways. Especially Spawn. (my hat of Todd McFarlane no no limit)

An animated Conan project of any kind is going to be seen and sought after by teens and pre-teens no matter what you rate it. That's because parents don't parent anymore, and rely on others to tell them what is ok for their kids to watch. They'll let their kids watch "adult" cartoons, simply because it's cartoons, and then get indignant when they realize the "perversions" they have let their kids watch, and try to blame the TV channel for airing it. Unfortunately, in today's world, there's no sense of personal responsibility, especially in parents. So, anyone making an "adult" cartoon has to bare that in mind, lest the project get "bad press" and lose sales because Ditzy Homemaker doesn't pay attention to what Johnny and Janey are watching.

/soapbox

[amster]

An animated Conan project of any kind is going to be seen and sought after by teens and pre-teens no matter what you rate it.

Exactly. So why try to compromise on the violence and the sensuality under the pretext of making it acceptable for youngsters? Back in the day, Savage Sword of Conan was clearly aimed at a more "mature" audience than CtB, but that never stopped me, an eleven year old, from reading it. On the contrary, it made me want to read it even more. And I don't believe that Marvel Comics were so naive to think that only grownups were reading it.

Last night I watched a new show on Adult Swim called Superjail, and it was one of the most violent and downright sick shows I've ever seen. I loved it! Judging by that, a Conan cartoon could easily be put in the same time slot with no compromises in the content.

[?sir]

Exactly. So why try to compromise on the violence and the sensuality under the pretext of making it acceptable for youngsters?

He already gave you a reason: Bad press.

Although bad publicity is still publicity. I don't know..

[Taranaich]

In all fairness, Spawn and The Maxx, as entertaining as they were, were pretty juvenile anyways. Especially Spawn.

I'd agree with you in terms of the execution and the actual narrative, but the fact that they managed to make a critically and commercially viable western animation containing sex, violence and strong language is pretty impressive, given the animation age ghetto western animation's still crawling out of. I just hope if a Conan animation comes out, the man in charge will have the clout to stop any snakish executive meddling to tone down or homogenize Conan.

(my hat of Todd McFarlane no no limit)

I'm sorry, I realize this is a typo, but it turn out to be delightful! I want a Hat of Todd McFarlane!

[amster]

Exactly. So why try to compromise on the violence and the sensuality under the pretext of making it acceptable for youngsters?

He already gave you a reason: Bad press.

Although bad publicity is still publicity. I don't know..

There are plenty of animated shows that are clearly aimed at an adults only audience. That doesn't mean that children still don't watch them. Put it on after 10pm, slap a TVMA rating on it, and the network is covered. If kids still watch it, that's their parent's fault.

[Reaver]

In all fairness, Spawn and The Maxx, as entertaining as they were, were pretty juvenile anyways. Especially Spawn.

I'd agree with you in terms of the execution and the actual narrative, but the fact that they managed to make a critically and commercially viable western animation containing sex, violence and strong language is pretty impressive, given the animation age ghetto western animation's still crawling out of. I just hope if a Conan animation comes out, the man in charge will have the clout to stop any snakish executive meddling to tone down or homogenize Conan.

(my hat of Todd McFarlane no no limit)

I'm sorry, I realize this is a typo, but it turn out to be delightful! I want a Hat of Todd McFarlane!

Actually it's a paraphrase of an old RPG forum post about d20: "my hat of d02 know no limit".

And my opinion of Spawn being juvenile was really just an opinion. I always thought Spawn was the most overrated character in the history of comics. And McFarlane's opinion of himself and his trash creation irritate the fecal matter out of me.

[?sir]

d02

Is that like when you flip a coin?

[Reaver]

Nevermind. The joke stops being funny when you have to explain it. I just thought there more gamers who knew the joke.

[Strom]

Don't forget to vote at the top of the page if you have an opinion on the subject. Let's show CPI how we feel!

[?sir]

Nevermind. The joke stops being funny when you have to explain it. I just thought there more gamers who knew the joke.

I guess you failed to get my joke too.

[Belisarius]

OK, I've cast my vote. Not only would the series be a great idea, but can you imagine how great they could make the dvd's. All the extras they could pack on would really make it a must have. They have to go for a more adult oriented theme however.

[nephron]

There's 2 questions being discussed here.

1. If there was an awesome Conan cartoon would you watch it?

Of course I would. It would be awesome.



2. Should CPI Develop a new Conan Animated Series?

No. No no no. Once again: no. There's no way they would do it right. The odds tell me it would suck. The overwhelming majority of everything with the "Conan" label is an insult to Howard's work, and there's no reason to think a new cartoon, a cartoon, mind you, would be any different. Nope. Leave it alone....just leave it alone.

Edited by nephron, 08 October 2008 - 12:09 AM.

[amster]

2. Should CPI Develop a new Conan Animated Series?

No. No no no. Once again: no. There's no way they would do it right. The odds tell me it would suck. The overwhelming majority of everything with the "Conan" label is an insult to Howard's work, and there's no reason to think a new cartoon, a cartoon, mind you, would be any different. Nope. Leave it alone....just leave it alone.

I really don't know what you're refering to when you say "the overwhelming majority".

The Del Rey REH Library doesn't suck.
The Gollanz Chronicles of Conan doesn't suck
The Dark Horse comics don't suck
The Marvel reprints don't suck (at least not the Roy Thomas ones)

Since Paradox took over CPI, most of the pastiches have been taken off the shelves. The Lancers have been retired...permanently, and have been replaced with pure REH texts. That doesn't suck.

I'd be more worried about the quality if CPI didn't have some oversite.

Edited by amsterdamaged, 08 October 2008 - 12:20 AM.

[nephron]

2. Should CPI Develop a new Conan Animated Series?

No. No no no. Once again: no. There's no way they would do it right. The odds tell me it would suck. The overwhelming majority of everything with the "Conan" label is an insult to Howard's work, and there's no reason to think a new cartoon, a cartoon, mind you, would be any different. Nope. Leave it alone....just leave it alone.

I really don't know what you're refering to when you say "the overwhelming majority".

The Del Rey REH Library doesn't suck.
The Gollanz Chronicles of Conan doesn't suck
The Dark Horse comics don't suck
The Marvel reprints don't suck (at least not the Roy Thomas ones)

Since Paradox took over CPI, most of the pastiches have been taken off the shelves. The Lancers have been retired...permanently, and have been replaced with pure REH texts. That doesn't suck.

I'd be more worried about the quality if CPI didn't have some oversite.

Nah dude. It's a better question to ask "What doesn't suck" when it comes to Conan. Nobody ever pays any attention to the stories, it's always about that damn movie and/or Frazetta. In fact, I just googled "conan computer game", and here's what the blurb about the game said.

It says, "Conan is a third-person action game based on the titular barbarian king featured in the cult classic comic book and portrayed in the Schwarzenneger films."

Any mention of Howard? No. You think the developers gave a crap about anything he wrote? Of course not. At most, they might have known who Frank Frazetta is, & drew inspiration from that, but more likely they were thinking about the movie & comic books. This is typical, and there's no reason to think an animated series would be any different, not when we look at examples of wanton disregard for Howard like:

That damn movie

That damn movie's sequel

The silly cartoon

The incomprehensibly awful live action TV show

90% of the comics (you're right about Dark Horse & Roy Thomas, though!)

video games (all of 'em)


It'd be great if we got a good animated Conan series that actually looked to Howard first, instead of Frazetta &/or that damn movie, but we all know that won't happen - especially if we're talkin' about a cartoon.

[amster]

I've never played the video games, so I can't comment on them, but...

That damn movie

That damn movie's sequel

The silly cartoon

The incomprehensibly awful live action TV show

post Roy Thomas comics

...all of those things happened before Paradox took over CPI.

[Belisarius]

I may be splitting hairs here but I think the term Animated Series is not the same as cartoon. When I think of cartoons I think of the old Saturday morning fare like Bugs Bunny or He-Man. Animated Series to me implies a different level of storytelling. I would agree the potential is here for this to be a disaster. However, CPI has done nothing that I know of to disparage Howard. Everything seems to point to them leading the way with preserving his works and his memory. So I am willing to give them the benfit of the doubt until they prove otherwise. Maybe if it was presented like this it would help:


Robert E. Howard's: Conan the Animated Series.

[mbern45]

I may be splitting hairs here but I think the term Animated Series is not the same as cartoon. When I think of cartoons I think of the old Saturday morning fare like Bugs Bunny or He-Man. Animated Series to me implies a different level of storytelling. I would agree the potential is here for this to be a disaster. However, CPI has done nothing that I know of to disparage Howard. Everything seems to point to them leading the way with preserving his works and his memory. So I am willing to give them the benfit of the doubt until they prove otherwise. Maybe if it was presented like this it would help:


Robert E. Howard's: Conan the Animated Series.

Unfortunately most people see animated and think "its a cartoon for kids".

I watch anime and I can tell you that there are some really great stories out there just wouldn't be possible with live actors so I accept an animated series as well as if it was live action, but most people wont. North America is especially bad in this. All animated shows are either cartoons for kids or comedies that don't have to be takes seriously, its very rare to have an animated show aimed at adults because the mindset is that you shouldn't be watching something for kids.

[amster]

Unfortunately most people see animated and think "its a cartoon for kids".

I watch anime and I can tell you that there are some really great stories out there just wouldn't be possible with live actors so I accept an animated series as well as if it was live action, but most people wont. North America is especially bad in this. All animated shows are either cartoons for kids or comedies that don't have to be takes seriously, its very rare to have an animated show aimed at adults because the mindset is that you shouldn't be watching something for kids.

I really don't think that's the case anymore. It all changed with "Batman: the Animated Series". It was still kid friendly, but it had plots and characters that were sophisticated enough to draw as many adult viewers as children, perhaps even more. A lot of adults (like virtually everyone on this forum) who grew up reading comic books and watching cartoons still enjoy reading comics and watching cartoons, and the market has responded by gearing their products towards us. Cartoon Network's entire late night schedule is geared towards an adult audience.

If they made a Conan cartoon geared primarily towards kids now, it would fail.

[?sir]

I think that is indeed the case still. At least with a few people in power of rating the movies here in Sweden. They automatically consider anything even based on something drawn to be a movie for children, and rate it accordingly no matter the amount of psychological terror, gore and violence, resulting in traumatised children nationwide, because their parents can't afford to go see a movie twice and so put their trust in the movie rating morons.

[JimmyPSHayes]

GREAT Idea!!!!! And, with the HUNDREDS of cable channels that are out there, I'm sure someone would be willing to carry an "adult" cartoon. Spike TV, perhaps? They seem to be keen on blood and guts and scantily-clad women. And I'm sure a Conan cartoon would draw big ratings for them. Bring it on!