[John Maddox Roberts]

If I were writing this, I'd set the first scene just after the battle of Venarium is over. Young Conan and his fellow Cimmerians survey the ruins. It's a frontier settlement but luxurious by Cimmerian standards.
Conan is enthralled by the governor's palace, the gold plate, the jewels, the colorful hangings, the late gov's harem of beautiful, scantily-clad concubines. The other Cimmerians are contemptuous of all these unmanly fripperies and chide Conan for his un-Cimmerian attitude. It will emphasize that Conan is atypical of his race and set up his quest for bling and good times.

There is actually precedent for this. In Japanese propaganda films of WWII Japanese soldiers were sometimes shown as entering the homes of Dutch and British colonial overlords. The Spartan, virtuous Japanese troops are always outraged and contemptuous of the luxurious furnishings and food they find there. It is proof of Western softness and decadence.

[Kortoso]

And it's a strong visual image, John.

[Amra]

Amra, on Jun 19 2009, 09:23 AM, said:

At some point before or even during the sack I think that it would be neat to emphasize "civilized" women, wine and coin, three of Conan's main "weaknesses" if you will. Perhaps his wanderlust stemmed not only from the death of his grandfather but also the images of the women and riches he'd seen during the sack. Images that he just couldn't shake...........

John Maddox Roberts, on Jun 19 2009, 01:08 PM, said:

If I were writing this, I'd set the first scene just after the battle of Venarium is over. Young Conan and his fellow Cimmerians survey the ruins. It's a frontier settlement but luxurious by Cimmerian standards.
Conan is enthralled by the governor's palace, the gold plate, the jewels, the colorful hangings, the late gov's harem of beautiful, scantily-clad concubines. The other Cimmerians are contemptuous of all these unmanly fripperies and chide Conan for his un-Cimmerian attitude. It will emphasize that Conan is atypical of his race and set up his quest for bling and good times.

There is actually precedent for this. In Japanese propaganda films of WWII Japanese soldiers were sometimes shown as entering the homes of Dutch and British colonial overlords. The Spartan, virtuous Japanese troops are always outraged and contemptuous of the luxurious furnishings and food they find there. It is proof of Western softness and decadence.

I sir, do like the way you think. Not bad at putting thoughts into sentences either !

This post has been edited by Amra: 19 June 2009 - 07:48 PM

[amsterdamaged]

John Maddox Roberts, on Jun 19 2009, 01:08 PM, said:

If I were writing this, I'd set the first scene just after the battle of Venarium is over. Young Conan and his fellow Cimmerians survey the ruins. It's a frontier settlement but luxurious by Cimmerian standards.
Conan is enthralled by the governor's palace, the gold plate, the jewels, the colorful hangings, the late gov's harem of beautiful, scantily-clad concubines. The other Cimmerians are contemptuous of all these unmanly fripperies and chide Conan for his un-Cimmerian attitude. It will emphasize that Conan is atypical of his race and set up his quest for bling and good times.

There is actually precedent for this. In Japanese propaganda films of WWII Japanese soldiers were sometimes shown as entering the homes of Dutch and British colonial overlords. The Spartan, virtuous Japanese troops are always outraged and contemptuous of the luxurious furnishings and food they find there. It is proof of Western softness and decadence.

They should fire O/P and hire Mark Finn and JMR as their screenwriting team.

[Almuric]

JMR: Not a bad idea, but I'd open with the Battle of Venarium, showing Conan being the first over the wall, to show how bold he is.

Note to Hollywood: Cimmerians are not Austrian.

[crossplain pilgrim]

I like JMR's idea of Conan being impressed with the wealth of Venarium. But like Almuric, I feel you have to open the film with the battle. Or just before it. I'd steal a scene from "The Vikings." To show that Conan isn't just another Cimmerian, I'd rework a version the scene where Kirk Douglas leaps across the moat onto the drawbridge and climbs it using the handles of axes tossed by his comrades. Let's the audience know that Conan has already been singled out to do great things.

[Fredrikmalmberg]

Glad midsommar! That's the annual swedish pagan holiday being celebrated today. People dance around a BIG POLE and then go to bed dreaming of who they will marry. Eh-hum. There is a great four part You Tube clip of a "banned" IKEA commercial which isn't too far from what actually happens. http://www.youtube.c...h?v=8I5BGsK5ZAU

Me, I'm in LA working.

Reading all your posts I think my reflection is that what your prioritize is a true portrayal of the character, that the tone is R and that we don't go against Howard's canon. That is exactly what we will try to achieve. Conan is not an easy character to portray on film, because he is not your usual hero. Here's from Wikipedia, defintion of Hero: "hero (male) and heroine (female) came to refer to characters (fictional or historical) that, in the face of danger and adversity or from a position of weakness, display courage and the will for self sacrifice – that is, heroism – for some greater good, originally of martial courage or excellence but extended to more general moral excellence."

Now here's from their description of an anti-hero: "In the postmodern era, traditionally defined heroic qualities, akin to the classic "knight in shining armor" type, have given way to the "gritty truth" of life, and authority in general is being questioned. The brooding vigilante or "noble criminal" archetype, seen in characters like Batman, is slowly becoming part of the popular conception of heroic valor rather than being characteristics that are deemed un-heroic."

I think it's pretty clear that to portray Conan correctly, we have to show the political uncorrectness, the barbarism vs civilization theme and his existentialism. It's hard to pinpoint one single favorite Howard quote, but this is a good one that shows Conan's psyche: "I have known many gods. He who denies them is as blind as he who trusts them too deeply. I seek not beyond death. It may be the blackness averred by the Nemedian skeptics, or Crom's realm of ice and cloud, or the snowy plains and vaulted halls of the Nordheimer's Valhalla. I know not, nor do I care. Let me live deep while I live; let me know the rich juices of red meat and stinging wine on my palate, the hot embrace of white arms, the mad exultation of battle when the blue blades flame and crimson, and I am content. Let teachers and priests and philosophers brood over questions of reality and illusion. I know this: if life is illusion, then I am no less an illusion, and being thus, the illusion is real to me. I live, I burn with life, I love, I slay, and am content. "

In the moviemaking process, there are many, many, opinions on everything from script, to choice of director, to cast and just about every little detail. And remember, all these professionals come in from their angle and skill set. If there is one single area where I hope my voice will be heard, and make an impression on the film, it is in the portrayal of Conan, how he acts and talks, and what his motivations are. If we nail that, and the audience responds, we have a franchise going.


PS. Latinoreview had it right. We have not yet hired the casting director. And the script has been in constant work and is being worked on fram various angles until shooting starts. That is standard operating procedure.

This post has been edited by Fredrikmalmberg: 20 June 2009 - 12:27 AM

[Reaver]

I can't speak for anyone else, but personally, if you get the character right, the rest of the movie is gravy. I mean, I would prefer a direct (or as near as possible) translation of a REH story (or stories). But if the character of Conan is true to Howard's vision, I would be happy with an original story.

Again, that's just me.

[Grimr]

I totally agree. Howard was constantly reminding us of the traits of his characters throughout his narratives - he wanted to paint a picture in our heads, and for the reader to be under no illusion about what the characters looked like, acted like, thought about, and what drove them. Because of this it will be very difficult to pull this off on screen, certainly to everyone's satisfaction. But nail Conan as a character and you more or less nail the movie.

[Kortoso]

Oops, that's right. Happy Summer Solstice.
Actually, that's tomorrow night.
Get that mead out, boy.

[crossplain pilgrim]

Thanks for coming back, Mr. Malmberg. It speaks to a nice consideration for the forum members. You made an excellent point about the importance of putting Howard's Conan up there on the screen (backed it up with a nice REH quote, too). Of course, it doesn't do much good to write a great role and then hire an entry-level body builder to play it. I'm not implying you have, of course. Just making a point. I would hope that the other characters would not just be generic stereotypes. Is it not possible to give the evil wizard his own personal history and motivation beyond just being a smooth talking dude who wants to take over the world because that's what evil wizards do? Can't he be just a little conflicted or complex?

You mentioned the dialog. The more of those poetic REH lines you can get in there, all the better. I know "making it real" for the kids is important, but please don't have Conan face an antagonist sword in hand and say, "Let's do it!"

Reading between the lines, one could interpret your comments as saying the script is still open for revision and changes. That would be great. I know you will be in there fighting for REH. I just hope when you sit down at those meetings the other guys are listening. What I would really hope for is the next time Paradox makes a film of a REH property, you do it yourself. You seem to have the understanding and sensibilities for it.

[Kortoso]

It's often argued that there aren't that many fans, that most people have not read the original tales. The movie's being made for the 99% who have no idea who REH is.

But, given a well-made movie, many of those people will become REH fans. They will go to the original works, and say, hey, I recognize this character, this is the same story as we saw on screen, and so on. We'll have lots of company.

[amsterdamaged]

Fredrikmalmberg, on Jun 19 2009, 03:30 PM, said:

I think it's pretty clear that to portray Conan correctly, we have to show the political uncorrectness, the barbarism vs civilization theme and his existentialism. It's hard to pinpoint one single favorite Howard quote, but this is a good one that shows Conan's psyche: "I have known many gods. He who denies them is as blind as he who trusts them too deeply. I seek not beyond death. It may be the blackness averred by the Nemedian skeptics, or Crom's realm of ice and cloud, or the snowy plains and vaulted halls of the Nordheimer's Valhalla. I know not, nor do I care. Let me live deep while I live; let me know the rich juices of red meat and stinging wine on my palate, the hot embrace of white arms, the mad exultation of battle when the blue blades flame and crimson, and I am content. Let teachers and priests and philosophers brood over questions of reality and illusion. I know this: if life is illusion, then I am no less an illusion, and being thus, the illusion is real to me. I live, I burn with life, I love, I slay, and am content. "

Wow. My favorite line from my favorite story. When I read the supposedly "leaked script" synopsis on Latino Review, it made me become jaded and cynical practically overnight. But quotes like this, coming from you, restore my faith in the project. Thanks.

Quote

In the moviemaking process, there are many, many, opinions on everything from script, to choice of director, to cast and just about every little detail. And remember, all these professionals come in from their angle and skill set. If there is one single area where I hope my voice will be heard, and make an impression on the film, it is in the portrayal of Conan, how he acts and talks, and what his motivations are. If we nail that, and the audience responds, we have a franchise going.

Then I take it to mean that Roland Kickinger has not been cast?

[Strom]

Sounds like he has:

New Conan Like Old Conan

[norse_sage]

Not necessarily:

http://www.latinorev...-not-conan-7187

Quote

Debunked: Kickinger NOT CONAN!
By El Mayimbe on June 18, 2009


I personally don't do debunk stories but it gives me great pleasure to debunk The Hollywood Reporter's Risky Biz Blog story tonight on the casting of CONAN.

Guess what folks?

Kickinger as Conan IS COMPLETE AND UTTER BULL****!

NOT ****ING TRUE!

Trust me guys, I have a super solid source at both Lionsgate and Millenium and they laughed their asses off!

Latinoreview have a pretty solid trackrecord in matters like these.

Fredrik, thank ever so much for posting. You are restoring a lot of faith in this. We all want Conan to succeed.

[Waldgeist]

You are absolutely right about the fact that we want to see the real Conan on screen, but that also means the dialogue must be somewhat reflective of REHs Conan and not too many silly one-liners (Sahara like) should come out of Conans mouth. Cheesyness would kill the movie for good. Also its important that the writers don't fool around with the past of Conan, or the parts of it that Howard set into stone, because he set them out, to give a basis for how Conan is.

I like to repeat myself (i am actually professionally trained as a CM to repeat myself hihi), a person that looses his mother at birth and his father in a young age cannot become Conan, he will lack a very deep part of security and sureness in life and as your quote has shown brilliantly, Conan is VERY sure of his life.

Many good suggestions here in this thread, even from very very skilled writers like JMR (i like your Conan pastiche the most and i really think of all the authors who have written Conan pastiche you found the way to portrait Conan that is the closest to Howard - not from writing, but from character and world style) and all of them sound better than what we have been told by people who read the first drafts of the O/D screenplay (aka less like the Kull movie, mixed with Milius Conan, mixed with american cheese).

Happy summer solstice!

Cheers,
Waldgeist

This post has been edited by Waldgeist: 20 June 2009 - 01:02 AM

[Amra]

Kortoso, on Jun 19 2009, 05:39 PM, said:

It's often argued that there aren't that many fans, that most people have not read the original tales. The movie's being made for the 99% who have no idea who REH is.

But, given a well-made movie, many of those people will become REH fans. They will go to the original works, and say, hey, I recognize this character, this is the same story as we saw on screen, and so on. We'll have lots of company.

Reading this makes me think of Braveheart. One of my all-time favorites.

[Majere]

http://movies.ign.co...6/996319p1.html

Filmforce is also reporting that Roland Kickinger is the current front runner to play everyone's favorite Cimmerian in the new Conan film.

Jesus.

Why does everyone assume Conan MUST possess the physique of a bodbuilder? Conan was always described as a giant man, no doubt, but I never got the feeling he was supposed to be ripped like Mr. Universe.

That stereotype came about, IMO, primarily because of Arnold's Schwarzengger's involvement with the film franchise. I don't understand why we can't get away from that image if, indeed, we are witnessing a rebirth of the Conan (film) franchise.

Alas, it seems the current director has no clue, as it is being reported that the film will be "drawing influences from more recent action pics."

WTF? How about drawing influences from the original source material for a change?

This post has been edited by Majere: 20 June 2009 - 06:32 AM

[norse_sage]

If you read the IGN report in detail,
you'll see that they actually aren't bringing anything new to the table what so ever, only rehashing what THE HOLLYWOOD REPORTER has said.

And it was that original THE HOLLYWOOD REPORTER story which was debunked and mocked in the process.

As such, IGN is only helping to spread a, from the looks of it, false rumour.
The above debunking applies here too.

[matsellah]

Makes you wonder what (or who) is sparking the false rumor. Kickinger isn't that big of a name, so he (or his camp) are the only ones that could gain.

And if that's the case... well, all the more reason to not want this guy.